To be fair, it is technically murder, but he can easily argue that deadly force was necessary to protect himself from an angry hippo that directly threatened his life.
Depending on the state in which the attack happens, it might or might not be murder. Ohio defines it in terms of a person, Texas defines it in terms of a human.
Skin Horse California Proposition 39 (2014) would clarify the status as persons, but not as human.
“I’m the best at what I do. And what I do is stir up discontent with the governing social order behind the scenes through the use of morally dubious, but thoroughly legal means”.
Nah, it lacks punch.
We had this discussion back in “If I Ran the Zoo,” but a great hole opened up in the internet and swallowed our comments. A lot of people said George Sanders. Those around my age, who were raised on Talespin, said Tony Jay. I still hear Tony Jay.
They have outside internet connectivity and transgenics generally know about their fate, so they’ll have lots of access to legal help in pretty short order.
I’m guessing they will be free as there statis will rise to personhood but actions taken before being a legal person wil no longer have any meaning. After all a crime cannot be commited by a non-human animal. If the power of the system that incarcerated them is defunct after the law is passed then no trail is necesary they go free. Untill they commit a new crime and are cought that shouldn’t take vey long since apperantly HT is a seriel murderer and will probably have a trail of corpeses leading to his door in like a day.
He’s sapient and committed a premeditated terrorist attack on a major city. Even if what you said was true, they’d find a way to punish him.
The law does not apply to humans only; it applies to persons, a word which has always been given a broad view. It appears they’ve had personhood status as long as Skin Horse has been around, but the criminal justice system hadn’t been equipped to punish nonhuman sapients.
A good lawyer might argue that their civil rights were violated, since they were held for an extended period without charge, but that would still only get them to a fair trial, not get them off.
Sapient, yes but it was my understanding that if you get put in the caves you lose personhood status. And considering that the rhino is in the caves as well. HT cannot be charged with murder.
I never saw things that way, I thought it just meant that you went somewhere else to get Social Security. If they are black ops social workers that puts them under OPM whereas nonhuman nonpersons would be covered by the Department of Fish and wildlife
We’ll soon be free, folks!
All thanks to Proposition Thirty-Nine!
You’ll follow me, folks!
Obey, do what I say, and you’ll be fine!
We must prepare …
But you just want to crush, you will not wait!
No, au contraire,
We must remain united, no debate!
So let me state …
I’m gonna kill you,
”Til you die!
It’s understood,
Sans personhood,
With laws, we don’t comply!
Your blood I’ll spill, you
Sil-ly guy!
You others, start obeying
Or I’m slaying
And saying
”Bye-bye!”
Hippos tend to have absurdly thick skin which is nearly impenetrable to most predators. Therefore, out of all of the silliness in this comic, with the mojo and the talking animals and whatnot, I find this to be the most unrealistic.
Mind you, I am ignoring a number of very plausible scenarios which would sort out the issue:
– We’re dealing with a transgenic hippo with much thinner skin than its wild brethren.
– HT used some additional very sharp implements that are capable of cutting through hippo skin.
– HT was modified with some additional very sharp implements of his own.
– HT will never be able to walk again.
I am hoping for the last option (in fact, that’s what I thought when I first saw that SKLORCH before I started reading), providing us with a little bit of perverse Karmic justice, but it’s probably more likely that our purple friend is no more.
Destruction of property and/or cruelty to animals. He could counter-argue that since he was, at the time, property (probably the state after the presumed death of his creator) or wildlife he can’t be held legally responsible for his actions at that time, but he’d still go to jail/trial if anyone was interested in having him arrested.
On the other hand his past behavior means even if nothing he did was technically illegal he can be placed on the terror watch list, and given his lack of citizenship, be indefinitely detained.
Personally, I’m more concerned with the inevitable problems of a necrocracy. Giving folk with almost universal mental problems and clinical immortality political power results in an undying class of regressive fossils holding back all of society.
Everybody knows the transgenics can simply be out-sexy’d.
Considering those with extreme mental problems can already be removed from the political process, they would at worst overload the system for a while until the crazy ones were dealt with.
It’s ambiguous in that strip– “white fur” could easily have been referring to Sweetheart there. (In fact, I think it makes more sense in context that that was referring to Sweetheart.)
The benefits of dictatorship are not afforded those in a democratic society with courtroom transparency. That, by the way, is what Shakespeare was taking about. There’s a reason the villains were advocating the removal of the lawyers.
There is no way a tiger could beat a hippopotamus in a straight up fight. The hippo is eight times heavier, has skin two inches thick, and can literally bite the tiger in half.
I’m sorry, but this strip REALLY broke my suspension of disbelief.
If they were a natural, ordinary hippopotamus and tiger, you would be correct.
However, we are dealing with products of Mad Science. Just looking at the two of them, there is no way that hippopotamus weighs anywhere near as much as an ordinary hippo. Its teeth are only a few inches long, as opposed to the 16 inch teeth in an ordinary hippo. There’s no telling how much hippo DNA it even has. For all we know, it could be almost entirely human, while only taking the basic appearance of a hippo. Even H.T. himself is nowhere near as large as an adult male tiger.
You can restore your suspension of disbelief simply by remembering what Helen Narbon was so fond of pointing out: Mad Science is not limited by the “possible”.
I have no idea why he would think that. Until the new law takes effect, the old one is still valid. It’s not like the old law vanishes when the referendum was completed, it goes away when the new law takes effect.
“This technically isn’t murder.”
SKLORCH!
“THAT’S GOOD, BECAUSE I’M TECHNICALLY NOT DEAD!!”
To be fair, it is technically murder, but he can easily argue that deadly force was necessary to protect himself from an angry hippo that directly threatened his life.
Depending on the state in which the attack happens, it might or might not be murder. Ohio defines it in terms of a person, Texas defines it in terms of a human.
Skin Horse California Proposition 39 (2014) would clarify the status as persons, but not as human.
First, he was just a webcomic artist. Now? Now he’s a murderous terrorist. Educate your kids about webcomics.
It’s Leo, not HT, who drew the webcomic, so the kids are alright. Do, however, educate them about power-hungry homicidal maniacs.
Initially, yes, but in “If I Ran the Zoo” we learned of a new artist:
http://www.webcomicsnation.com/shaenongarrity/skinhorse/series.php?view=archive&chapter=48602#strip5
Love the “snkt”. Only really dangerous claws go “snkt”.
H.T.’s the best there is at what he does, bub.
“I’m the best at what I do. And what I do is stir up discontent with the governing social order behind the scenes through the use of morally dubious, but thoroughly legal means”.
Nah, it lacks punch.
“I’m the best at what I do, and what I do is technically legal.”
Wow, whoever engineered that hippo must have really cut back on the deadliness factor. I would not have bet money on a tiger in that fight.
Somebody mentioned Shere Khan the other day … Now HT’s voice has become George Saunders in my head. Now I like HT even more.
We had this discussion back in “If I Ran the Zoo,” but a great hole opened up in the internet and swallowed our comments. A lot of people said George Sanders. Those around my age, who were raised on Talespin, said Tony Jay. I still hear Tony Jay.
Yes. Just yes.
HT seems to have a pretty naive view of legality. Then again, being a cat, he’ll probably get away with it.
Given their current “non-person” status, this is just another wildlife incident.
Yeah, I’m curious how he plans to escape from this place. I mean, doesn’t he need a legal argument and some lawyers to get them out of there?
They have outside internet connectivity and transgenics generally know about their fate, so they’ll have lots of access to legal help in pretty short order.
I’m guessing they will be free as there statis will rise to personhood but actions taken before being a legal person wil no longer have any meaning. After all a crime cannot be commited by a non-human animal. If the power of the system that incarcerated them is defunct after the law is passed then no trail is necesary they go free. Untill they commit a new crime and are cought that shouldn’t take vey long since apperantly HT is a seriel murderer and will probably have a trail of corpeses leading to his door in like a day.
He’s sapient and committed a premeditated terrorist attack on a major city. Even if what you said was true, they’d find a way to punish him.
The law does not apply to humans only; it applies to persons, a word which has always been given a broad view. It appears they’ve had personhood status as long as Skin Horse has been around, but the criminal justice system hadn’t been equipped to punish nonhuman sapients.
A good lawyer might argue that their civil rights were violated, since they were held for an extended period without charge, but that would still only get them to a fair trial, not get them off.
Sapient, yes but it was my understanding that if you get put in the caves you lose personhood status. And considering that the rhino is in the caves as well. HT cannot be charged with murder.
Wait a second. The big guy is a hippo isn’t he?Rhino’s have horns, and different teeth
The fact that Skin Horse is Black Ops suggests that they did not, in fact, have personhood before the law until now.
I never saw things that way, I thought it just meant that you went somewhere else to get Social Security. If they are black ops social workers that puts them under OPM whereas nonhuman nonpersons would be covered by the Department of Fish and wildlife
(TUNE: “Thriller”, Michael Jackson)
We’ll soon be free, folks!
All thanks to Proposition Thirty-Nine!
You’ll follow me, folks!
Obey, do what I say, and you’ll be fine!
We must prepare …
But you just want to crush, you will not wait!
No, au contraire,
We must remain united, no debate!
So let me state …
I’m gonna kill you,
”Til you die!
It’s understood,
Sans personhood,
With laws, we don’t comply!
Your blood I’ll spill, you
Sil-ly guy!
You others, start obeying
Or I’m slaying
And saying
”Bye-bye!”
Altarboy: and that’s why it’s technically not murder
jdreyfuss: no, as they currently are not concerned ‘people’, one animal killing another is not murder, but the great Circle of Life
I didn’t say ‘people,’ I said ‘persons.’ Those are two different things. You can murder a legal person, regardless of whether he’s an actual person.
Polloxs! replace ‘concerned’ with ‘considered’
Hippos tend to have absurdly thick skin which is nearly impenetrable to most predators. Therefore, out of all of the silliness in this comic, with the mojo and the talking animals and whatnot, I find this to be the most unrealistic.
Mind you, I am ignoring a number of very plausible scenarios which would sort out the issue:
– We’re dealing with a transgenic hippo with much thinner skin than its wild brethren.
– HT used some additional very sharp implements that are capable of cutting through hippo skin.
– HT was modified with some additional very sharp implements of his own.
– HT will never be able to walk again.
I am hoping for the last option (in fact, that’s what I thought when I first saw that SKLORCH before I started reading), providing us with a little bit of perverse Karmic justice, but it’s probably more likely that our purple friend is no more.
Yeah, I found it odd that out of everything it was this that broke my suspension of disbelief
Murder? Nah. Purple talking bipedal nonhumans are fair game even if they’re not dinosaurs.
Destruction of property and/or cruelty to animals. He could counter-argue that since he was, at the time, property (probably the state after the presumed death of his creator) or wildlife he can’t be held legally responsible for his actions at that time, but he’d still go to jail/trial if anyone was interested in having him arrested.
On the other hand his past behavior means even if nothing he did was technically illegal he can be placed on the terror watch list, and given his lack of citizenship, be indefinitely detained.
Personally, I’m more concerned with the inevitable problems of a necrocracy. Giving folk with almost universal mental problems and clinical immortality political power results in an undying class of regressive fossils holding back all of society.
Everybody knows the transgenics can simply be out-sexy’d.
Considering those with extreme mental problems can already be removed from the political process, they would at worst overload the system for a while until the crazy ones were dealt with.
It has lots of slice, though.
That was meant to be a reply to tpmanw, way back up the page. Darn it.
I always thought HT was a white tiger. I thought http://skin-horse.com/comic/todays-comic-649/ was evidence.
It’s ambiguous in that strip– “white fur” could easily have been referring to Sweetheart there. (In fact, I think it makes more sense in context that that was referring to Sweetheart.)
From political activist to extremist to dark overlord.
Didn’t Artie compare him to Magneto at one point? H.T.’s certainly taking some of the same turns at his worst. Or perhaps Voldemort at his best.
Vetinari would not waste time with those silly legalistic arguments…
The benefits of dictatorship are not afforded those in a democratic society with courtroom transparency. That, by the way, is what Shakespeare was taking about. There’s a reason the villains were advocating the removal of the lawyers.
There is no way a tiger could beat a hippopotamus in a straight up fight. The hippo is eight times heavier, has skin two inches thick, and can literally bite the tiger in half.
I’m sorry, but this strip REALLY broke my suspension of disbelief.
If they were a natural, ordinary hippopotamus and tiger, you would be correct.
However, we are dealing with products of Mad Science. Just looking at the two of them, there is no way that hippopotamus weighs anywhere near as much as an ordinary hippo. Its teeth are only a few inches long, as opposed to the 16 inch teeth in an ordinary hippo. There’s no telling how much hippo DNA it even has. For all we know, it could be almost entirely human, while only taking the basic appearance of a hippo. Even H.T. himself is nowhere near as large as an adult male tiger.
You can restore your suspension of disbelief simply by remembering what Helen Narbon was so fond of pointing out: Mad Science is not limited by the “possible”.
Ah, a *technical* moralist.
The worst kind of moralist.
I have no idea why he would think that. Until the new law takes effect, the old one is still valid. It’s not like the old law vanishes when the referendum was completed, it goes away when the new law takes effect.